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September 20th, 2013
08:00 PM ET

Rick Warren on his late son: "Matthew was not afraid to die...he was afraid of pain"

On the heels of huge reaction to Piers Morgan's interview with Rick and Kay Warren, this evening CNN is re-airing the candid, hour-long conversation.

Less than six months ago, the well-known American evangelical Christian pastor lost his son to a self-inflicted gunshot wound, an emotional and heartbreaking end to a life defined by battles with mental health.

Joined by his wife, tonight Warren's interview on "Piers Morgan Live" represents the couple's first media appearance since Matthew's passing, as the pair describes in great detail the demons their son battled:

"Matthew was not afraid to die. He was afraid of pain. I remember 10 years ago, when he was 17, he came to me sobbing," reveals Warren, offering an absolutely heart-wrenching story about his late son. "He said, 'daddy,' he said, 'it's really clear, I'm not going to get any better. You know, we've gone to the best doctors, the best hospitals, the best treatment therapists. Everything ... prayer, everything you could imagine ... good support.' And he says, 'it's real clear I'm not going to get any better, so why can't I just die.'"

Asked by the host for Warren's reaction to his son at that time, the senior pastor of Saddleback Church shared his message:

"I said, 'Matthew, the reason why, is there is a purpose, even in our pain. And I am not willing to just give up and say that the solution isn't there. You might give up, but as your father, as your mother, we're not ever giving up, that we won't find the solution,'" he explains to Piers Morgan. "I really believe Matthew could have been a great advocate for children in the world. He was an amazingly compassionate kid."

Watch the above clip as Warren goes on to explain the ways in which Matthew often sought out others struggling, hoping to help ease their pain. Then, for the entire, hour-long interview with the man that leads the eighth-largest church in the United States, tune in to CNN tonight at 9.
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  1. Bel

    Suicide leaves horror in its wake. Not just the mentally ill commit suicide. There is a growing trend among the elderly. It is definitely the worst thing to happen to families. My elderly father recently committed suicide and it has been difficult. We did not have a clue this would ever happen to him. The guilt and pain that follows the survivors is a terrible burden. I am so sorry for your loss. I hope that you are able to turn your grief into something that has a positive impact. I am still struggling and trying to find a way to turn mine into some sort of catalyst for change, I don't know how I will do this but will be looking to you for inspiration.

    September 20, 2013 at 9:12 pm | Report abuse | Reply
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      September 23, 2013 at 8:18 pm | Report abuse | Reply
  2. Ron Ward

    I feel so sad for the Rick and Kay Warren, with the loss of their son Matthew. My family is grateful to have found two amazingly helpful consumer magazines on mental illness and coping. One is call bp magazine, for people who suffer from bipolar disorder, the other is called esperanza magazine, for people who suffer from anxiety and depression.

    September 20, 2013 at 9:19 pm | Report abuse | Reply
  3. Michelle

    Thanks for this segment. Mental illness can be just as difficult and often times just as fatal as physical illnesses such as cancer and we all need to be compassionate and pray for those that are suffering and struggling with this illness. Love and prayers to the victims and their loved ones. It appears Matthew did a lot of good work in his short life. Love and blessings to the Warrens.

    September 20, 2013 at 10:00 pm | Report abuse | Reply
  4. Randy

    I find it sad that this man who is suppose to be a follower of God talks about Gods plan then turns around and blames his son for committing suicide then turn because of mental illness is disgusting to me as a parent. Mr. Warren you can't have it both ways either Gods plan or not do not blame an illness it was Gods plan so you say. And you speak more highly of God than your son, how disgusting.

    September 20, 2013 at 10:06 pm | Report abuse | Reply
    • Marlon

      Randy, I don't believe Rick ever claimed God made his son mentally ill. We live in a fallen world of brokenness and pain where God's perfect intent and design doesn't always come about. What Rick did make clear is that even in the midst of our pain, suffering, and imperfection, God can still work in it, redeem it, and turn it around for good. As he said, "in the garden of God's grace, even a broken tree bears fruit."

      September 20, 2013 at 11:09 pm | Report abuse | Reply
      • Karl Schneider

        What a steaming pile of equine excrement...the TRVE BELIEVERS go on and on, ad nauseum, about "GAWD'S PLAN" but they spend half their misbegotten lives begging their make-believe deity to CHANGE that plan. If that isn't a plain indication of insanity, there are none.

        September 21, 2013 at 8:17 pm | Report abuse |
  5. Randy

    just to let you know my brother committed suicide a year ago and just like your son why didn't your so called god think there lives were not worthy of saving ? If your god is the almighty how can you continue praising him when he didn't think your son sons life was worthy of saving ? I think because if you say anything against god your income will be in serious jeopardy. No need to respond you know I am right.

    September 20, 2013 at 11:03 pm | Report abuse | Reply
    • John

      It's clear that you despise Rick Warren. I wonder if you've been to Saddleback and know exactly how much he has done. You're bitter and angry, get some help.......

      September 21, 2013 at 9:20 am | Report abuse | Reply
      • Karl Schneider

        The insanity of religion is (far too slowly) being cured as time passes. http://www.godisimaginary.com

        September 21, 2013 at 8:15 pm | Report abuse |
    • Jenny

      Randy – I am deeply sorry for your loss, as well as for the loss of the whole Warren family. I also lost my brother to suicide and can sympathize the pain and grief you are experiencing. My brother and I were very close and I prayed for him all the time when he was suffering from his depression. So after he took his life, I struggled spiritually and wanted to blame God. However, I have since realized that God loves us too much to take away our free will. Note that I do not blame my brother either, he was a victim of his depression and the spiritual warfare that was going on around him and within him. I find comfort in knowing that my brother rests peacefully now in the presence of our great God and am so thankful that the same loving almighty God was willing to send his only begotten Son to suffer the punishment WE deserved so that my brother could share in His inheritance!
      I miss my brother everyday and wish very badly that he were still here with me, but cherish the fond memories I have of him and thank God for the 31 years our family got to enjoy him!

      September 23, 2013 at 1:33 am | Report abuse | Reply
    • brasstacs

      I don't understand how atheist can be so "emphatic" in their beliefs that denies the existence of a higher power..considering that it would be as far over the human mind as quantum physics is over head of a chicken...We're are not capable of mentally understanding with reason...But we are capable of knowing with intuition..and we can't even explain that.

      September 23, 2013 at 7:25 pm | Report abuse | Reply
  6. Tina

    I would like to sympathies with Rick & Kay and I would like to thank them for being so open about mental illness. Mental illness need more media coverage.
    Estrangement is a silent epidemic related to mental illness that needs media recognition. Estrangement is more common than Autism & maybe also liked to early stages of Alzheimer's

    Injustice Collecting
    http://www.psychologytoday.com/articles/200612/injustice-collecting

    September 20, 2013 at 11:14 pm | Report abuse | Reply
  7. Jane

    My condolences to this family and to all who have suffered and are suffering in the wake of mental illness. It destroys people and families and it is not given the same compassion as physical illness which makes it that much harder to bear. It is chronic like cancer, relapses and is hard to treat. Psychiatrists are not on the same kind of medical plans so treatment is not easily accessible and it is prohibitively expensive for good treatment. This family experienced that as do m ost who are up against this type of illness. Is this why so many kill mthemselves? They lose hope and there is a lack of accessibility to care

    September 20, 2013 at 11:43 pm | Report abuse | Reply
    • Clyde Bridger

      My condolences as well to the Warren family. But it troubles me when they talk about how people who have a mental illness should never have a gun (and I agree with that), but they knew their son was suicidal and they also knew he had a gun one month before he took his life. Why didn't they do something, when they had the chance, to stop it from happening?
      All the background checks in the world won't prevent mentally ill people from getting guns if their family just turns a blind eye to it all and says its God's will! We need to be proactive about this problem if we are going to fix it!

      September 22, 2013 at 7:19 am | Report abuse | Reply
      • KfromR

        Clyde, I can answer your question about why the Warrens didn't take away his gun because I have personally been in this same position. Their son would have just gone out and purchased another one. That's what my child did.

        September 22, 2013 at 7:34 pm | Report abuse |
      • Clyde Bridger

        That's sad, so very sad KfromR, but at least you tried. We just can't raise our hands in the air and stop trying. Mental illness is a very tough issue to deal with. It takes a persistent vigilance to stay on top of it. There are so many types of mental illness and not everyone who suffers from it is stupid, some are quite clever indeed. They're not all like the characters in "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest"! A lot of them are living with us in our neighborhoods, right under our noses. But their family members should know them well and should be watching out for them, as much as possible! You just can't entrust their welfare to the authorities, they are already overwhelmed with large case loads.

        September 23, 2013 at 7:13 am | Report abuse |
  8. Karl Schneider

    The most incredible aspect of stories like this is that humans are STILL willing to believe in imaginary gods. Does religion make people insane, or do crazy people just gravitate to it?...that is the real mystery. One thing is for sure, if my dad had been anything like this Rick SOB I would have offed myself too...and probably a lot sooner, just as my school friend and neighbor Ronnie Roberts (son of the late money-grubbing SOB Oral) did.

    September 21, 2013 at 8:13 pm | Report abuse | Reply
    • Clyde Bridger

      Religion offers an easy way out for those individuals who cannot, or simply refuse to, accept Evolution. There is also the herd mentality where if you get enough people believing in something, no matter how preposterous. then more people will start to believe it too, and so it snowballs from there. A case in point was when most people around the world celebrated the new millennium a year early, at the end of the year 1999 instead of the year 2000. Simple math proves that was wrong, but millions of people around the world never questioned it and gladly jumped on the bandwagon. When people stop using their commonsense and let themselves to be misled by individuals who got it wrong, that's when mistakes happen!

      September 22, 2013 at 4:30 pm | Report abuse | Reply
  9. Vince

    It takes more of an imagination to believe that there isn't a God then it takes to believe that there is a God. To thank that life simply started from a big bang, and then we started evolving to become the people we are today, the only problem with that theory or the question that I have, why did we stop evolving. God is a good and perfect God, but we as a people have and is falling away from His good and perfect will each and every day. God doesn't cause pain and suffering, man does..Remember, God has given man free will.

    September 21, 2013 at 9:04 pm | Report abuse | Reply
    • Clyde Bridger

      Sorry to burst your bubble Vince, but we are still evolving, as is every other living thing on this planet! Evolution happens very slowly over a never ending time frame. It is so slow that it is almost imperceptible over our individual lifespans, but it is occurring each and every day.

      September 22, 2013 at 6:55 am | Report abuse | Reply
    • Clyde Bridger

      Furthermore Vince, just because you don't understand evolution, because it's too much for your imagination, doesn't mean that it isn't true. It is true! There is overwhelming evidence in the biological sciences to prove it. Our evolutionary origin is all there in our DNA, and the same is true for all the other fauna and flora.

      September 22, 2013 at 8:05 am | Report abuse | Reply
      • Thomas

        Clyde, I respect your willingness to promote your beliefs. However, I would like to point out that evolution doesn't disprove a God or higher power of any sort. If evolution is true or not I will never truly know, but there are plenty of theistic scientists that believe in evolution. Look at Francis Collins. I suppose he is far more intelligent than you and I. If evolution is true, I think evolution proves some sort of super natural force (I'm not even claiming a God, but something super natural) because the stages of evolution are nearly impossible. Just look at the chances of an amino acid randomly forming, that is 1 in 10^40. And this stat is from a pro-evolution site. Moreover, Stanley miller's experiment regarding randomly forming molecules is now void. That's only the chances of an amino acid coming together. This doesn't include self-replicatiing proteins and DNA which has more information than 30,000 encyclopedias If evolution is indeed true, there has to be something beyond nature that pushes life change. And the answer is not simply nature. The law of entropy says nature goes from complex to simple. This is just a discussion on "chance". We won't get to the cambrian explosion and fossil record. We could also talk about one of the finest minds to ever walk the earth in Albert Einstein and talk about how his theories regarding the Big Bang also pointed him and us towards a creator or something supernatural.
        Mr. Bridger, please don't let evolution block your view of God. Whether we believe in evolution or not, that is not the thing that matters. There are plenty of Christians in the biological community that believe in God and not evolution, and there are Scientist Christians that believe in God and evolution. That's not the important debate. The question is who was Jesus? I'm not just some ignorant religious person like some of my friends who just say believe and don't ask questions. But literally, who was this Jesus guy when he was on earth?

        Now to the article and just a general statement not directed to Mr. Clyde:
        Bless the Warren's and their family. I love them. They are wonderful people and are world-changers. I hope and pray that anyone with a mental illness will seek and find help. I am heart broken by Matthew's story and stories that are similar.

        Christians: Don't be afraid to test your faith. Jesus is who he says he is. There have been thousands people, movements and theories that have tried to disprove that He is the son of God since he was here in the first century, yet his name alone is STILL changing lives.

        September 25, 2013 at 2:15 pm | Report abuse |
  10. Trisha Jackson

    Thank you for such an open and honest discussion on the epidemic of suicide. My husband who was a wonderful father and husband fatally shot himself on 11-16-2006 while I was watching. He done it too fast for me to try to stop him. I really think he had it pre-planned for over a week. He suffered for many years from some form of mental illness that I believe stemmed from his childhood. He would not talk about it. I KNOW he loved me and the children, but the pain won out and yes, I will always have many questions and still suffer from that moment and will for the rest of my life here on earth. We were both saved by the blood of Jesus, and my faith is still here and what keeps me hanging on. Didn't mean to say so much, but am thankful that the issue of mental illness is being talked about. It has been taboo for WAY too long!

    September 21, 2013 at 9:05 pm | Report abuse | Reply
  11. chery

    thank you so much or doing this segment. as was mentioned,if you have anything else wrong with your body it is accepted. if you have mental ilness you are the last to be able to get help or acknowledged or accepted.

    September 22, 2013 at 12:01 am | Report abuse | Reply
  12. Maria

    Thank you for sharing such a difficult testimony, please accept all my condolences. Your interview actually helped me understand myself better and realize I am not alone. I've been diagnosed with deep depression for many years and also managed to play the good actress and I would take my imaginary mask coming back from work and go straight to bed where I would hide from the world.

    I have been on all different treatments and medications – I'm also blessed with a wonderful family so I understand and can relate to how your son was feeling. I'm now home on sick leave due to this depression I can no longer hide and suicide has been on my mind for many years. This is definately an illness which is so misunderstood and unfortunately many are still judged. However, one must live an experience to fully understand it.

    Thank you again for this interview, I will continue to seek help and continue to pray for guidance. May God continue to give you the strength and courage you need to still spark a light in everyone's hearts. You are very special people.

    September 22, 2013 at 1:03 am | Report abuse | Reply
  13. Ninja

    Please, please bring more light on another mental health disorder.
    Parental Alienation Disorder
    http://cspas.ca/

    September 22, 2013 at 11:34 pm | Report abuse | Reply
  14. Isabella

    Where can I see the whole interview, its so good to feel supported with this. Borderline Personality disorder is a horrid illness, yet no one has heard of it, schizophrenia is much more well known yet it affects the same amount of people and is just as bad. Thanks to the Warrens for making people aware, especially Christians because they are the most unhelpful most often. They just dont get mental health issues, yet they have the potential to help more than they know.

    September 23, 2013 at 4:35 am | Report abuse | Reply
  15. Dan

    Why is it that we have to get a foreigners to comment on our country? Don't we have enough qualified American leftist nancy boy commentators here? I don't watch him very much at all. I used to watch CNN exclusively, but you guys see things way left and no right. I don't see the point. I hate to say this, but other places are more fair and balanced. Play nice and see how many folks watch.

    September 23, 2013 at 10:16 am | Report abuse | Reply
  16. Andy

    The CNN interview had many holes in Matthew Warren's suicide story. Rick and Kay did not come clean about their son's problems and suicide.

    September 23, 2013 at 1:37 pm | Report abuse | Reply
  17. nooneytunes2002

    To Randy, I too know the feeling of loosing a brother. My brother took his life on July 5, 2009, I was with him the night before he took his life. I had no idea that was going to happen. Now when I look back I saw signs of depressions. My brother had felonies on his record because of trouble he got in high school. But he turned from that and start doing better. My brother love driving trucks for a living, but it just seem like he couldn't just seem to catch a break because of trouble he got in high school. I blame myself and God because i felt like i should have seen this thing coming and i should have given encouragement. My brother that night before he died he paste from living room to another bedroom in house back and forth. I was going through my own thing blinded by my own problems and couldn't see his issues. I to remember that day before in his backpack was a gun in it and he call out my name and say u on my gun. well if i knew that gun was going to take my brother out, i would have threw that gun in the woods or somewhere. Too I never thought to much of it because my brothers always took guns around. People think that people who commit suicide is in hell, but i know for a fact that God knows the heart of a individual and sometimes is not like that. For my brother I believe he is with God because I see him in my dreams and in His presence. He dosen't look like the old person but a new person with no worries and trouble of the world. Instead he teaching me from God presence to how to hang on and be encourage. I too have memories of him in pictures and in my mind. I can remember when a time when I was younger he pick me and my other brother up and we was like do it again and thew up in little walmart/roses swimming pool.

    September 23, 2013 at 3:08 pm | Report abuse | Reply
  18. John

    Is it possible that Warren's son was GAY and just couldn't deal with the religious oppression in his household?!? Hmmmmmm . . . kind of makes you wonder.

    September 24, 2013 at 9:14 pm | Report abuse | Reply

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